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Applying to college is stressful enough. Navigating the financial aid process adds a whole new layer. And for children of immigrants, including those with undocumented parents, the process comes with even greater hurdles and anxieties.
Producers Jasmyn Centeno, a senior at Uncommon Leadership High School, and Jojo Fofana, a senior at Fordham High School for the Arts, explore the frustrating and complicated experience many students — including themselves — have when navigating the FAFSA process.
For students like “Gabby,” whose mother is undocumented, applying for financial aid comes with very real fears at a time of heightened deportation concerns under the Trump administration.
Danielle Insel, a counselor at University Neighborhood High School, sheds light on the systemic barriers and technical glitches students face, along with the emotional support they need to get through it as they find their path to college affordability.
P.S. Weekly is available on major podcast platforms, including Apple Podcasts and Spotify. Reach us at PSWeekly@chalkbeat.org.
P.S. Weekly is a collaboration between Chalkbeat and The Bell, made possible by generous support from The Pinkerton Foundation.
Listen for new P.S. Weekly episodes Thursdays this spring.
Read the transcript below
News reporter: You’ve said roughly 14,000 migrants have been arrested in the first month of this administration.
Jasmyn: Welcome to P.S. weekly, the sound of the New York City school system. I’m Jasmyn Centeno
Jojo: And I’m Jojo Fofana, and today we’re thinking about immigration.
News reporter: The Trump administration did away with a long standing policy that largely kept ICE from making arrests in schools.
News interviewee: So then they come to school thinking that maybe they could be safe here, but that’s not something that we are able to guarantee anymore.
Jasmyn: Well, not just immigration. We’re thinking more about the children of immigrants.
Jojo: Oh, why?
Jasmyn: Because more of us are applying to college
Jojo: and we’re having a hard time being able to afford it.
News reporter: And for those with at least one undocumented parent, FAFSA applications are down 44%
Jasmyn: Today, Jojo and I will discuss the process of financial aid for first generation students who are children of immigrant and undocumented parents, and how they’re navigating the college application process, and when I say they, I actually mean we. Jojo, how’s your experience been with FAFSA?
Jojo: All right? Well, my mom is from Sierra Leone, and she wasn’t a citizen until not too long ago, so we had a lot to explain to FAFSA on why I couldn’t fill out certain things, and I felt like you have to fill out all these bells and whistles to even think about even affording college.
You have to prove a lot, such as what school your parents went to. That might not be able to be found on the search right, because, like, my mom’s from Africa, so that’s just, you’re not finding it, right. How much money you expected to make, or, like, your social security, if they’re even a legal citizen. And that was, like, definitely complicated for my mom to answer.
Jasmyn: Yeah, I had a similar experience proving that I’m even a low income, first generation college student, specifically when finding documents. For my dad, he didn’t even have experience sharing his 1040 or his W2 documents, and it kind of made him feel like he was being interrogated.
As high school seniors ourselves, we understand the college application process can be incredibly stressful. We write multiple essays and draft personal statements. But there are other thoughts that linger within the minds of most future college students, and that’s financial aid.
Jojo: For New York State residents, specifically, there are financial aid resources provided, such as TAP (the tuition assistance) program that helps New York State students pay for college.
Jasmyn: And on the federal side, there’s FAFSA. FAFSA stands for Free Application for Federal Student Aid.
Jojo: There’s a recent survey of 600 first generation FAFSA applicants from study.com. The study showed that FAFSA complications have not only delayed their college decisions, but in some cases, have derailed their educational plans altogether.
Almost half of first generation students have trouble filling out their FAFSA. 86% of those surveyed said they considered other options due to FAFSA uncertainties, such as additional scholarships or alternative loans. Some try to get even more work hours towards their college expenses, and some consider delaying their enrollment. So this is one of the many struggles we’ve had, but let’s hear another perspective on it from your friend, right?
Jasmyn: My best friend of five years has experienced firsthand complications when it comes to applying for FAFSA.
Jasmyn: So previously, you were already mentioning, hold on. She wanted to share her own story under the alias Gabby. I know that you said your mom was born in Trinidad. So while she was there, did she ever receive higher education in high school or through college?
Gabby: She did seek a higher education in high school, and she did go to college, but she never got to finish.
Jasmyn: What would you say is the hardest aspect is about being a first generation student
Gabby: Financial aid.
Jasmyn: And why is that?
Gabby: Because it’s a harder process. I mean, not because I’m a first generation student, but because she’s undocumented. I mean because she went to school in Trinidad, it’s not the same as the American process. So she doesn’t really know what common app and all the stuff are, but I also don’t share that stuff with her. It’s made the financial aid process hard. It was very stressful.
There was nights where I needed to ask my mom for a lot of information, and she didn’t have it or I–she didn’t know what it was. Yeah, some things I had to, the process was very long, longer than it should have been, because she’s undocumented. But, yeah.
Jasmyn: When you say she was unfamiliar with some documents, would you mind referring to which ones those were.
Gabby: For IRS, when you’re signing in, it asks you to do, asks you for a certain type of taxes, but you have to be a citizen to have them or pay taxes. My mother doesn’t pay that– well, she just started, but she didn’t pay taxes. You need a ID, a state ID, she didn’t have that. Well, she still doesn’t, and just stuff that you need to be a citizen in order to have those type of documents.
Gabby: At first, I thought I would have to use my aunt’s taxes, because my mom did put me on my aunt’s taxes, thinking that I would need it in the future. But thankfully, on FAFSA, I was able to just put that my mom doesn’t have her social security number, so it made it really easy, but it makes me question, like, have I put a target on my mom because of this? But also, like, would I be able to afford school? So even though it took, like, a very long process because she didn’t have, like, her socials, I did get the full thing, so I’m very thankful.
Jasmyn: So how did you feel when you realized you couldn’t answer your mom’s documents?
Gabby: I felt like it was time to move on. I didn’t want to dwell on it, because there wasn’t much I could do, and it’s scary time where telling your situation can backfire on you, because hearing that Trump was starting to deport people who didn’t have their papers, it was kind of scary, and I wanted to make sure that my mom was safe.
And I didn’t know if it was more important that I get my education than not knowing where my mom would be.
Jasmyn: Can you describe to me the moment when you initially realized that your mom being undocumented would have been an issue for you growing up?
Gabby: I didn’t really realize until high school, but my mom had told me she was–she didn’t have her papers when I was in elementary because I think she figured out herself that I wouldn’t be able to do a lot of stuff, or, like some things, would be limited.
Jasmyn: And that experience itself. How did that make you feel?
Gabby: I felt okay.
Jasmyn: Girl! And I know you didn’t. Why are you lying? Why are you lying?
Gabby: They don’t need to know that
Jasmyn: They don’t even know who you are, baby like,
Gabby: Ok but I don’t wanna put that out there
Jasmyn: No literally you’re acting like, it’s very chill.
Gabby: I’ve been living with it for a good long days,
Jasmyn: But you’ve been living with it. But like, when you initially found out, like, of course, like the feeling was gonna, like, dim down after a while, but like, how did you feel? Like you initially knew.
Gabby: You know what? Pass me the mic.
Jasmyn: What emotions did you feel at the moment?
Gabby: I felt sad at the moment, I felt sad. I didn’t really understand, like, what it would meant for the future, and I cried, and my mom didn’t even understand why I was crying. I didn’t understand why I was crying. But...
Jasmyn: How did your mom not understand why you were crying? If, like, she had just told you that she was undocumented.
Gabby: Because my mom is Trindadian she’s, she’s a very tough lady. So, like, crying isn’t really a thing in our, in our family. So whenever I cry, my mom doesn’t really understand why I cry.
Jasmyn: Did you talk to anyone about it?
Gabby: No.
Jasmyn: You didn’t reference like a friend or a counselor.
Gabby: No, this is the first time I’m ever talking about my mom’s situation to anyone.
Jasmyn: Did you talk to your mother about it?
Gabby: No, my mom doesn’t really talk about it, nor does she want to.
Jojo: That sounds really hard, especially when you take into account that the FAFSA Simplification Act passed in 2020 this act was supposed to help people like Gabby and minimize the amount of questions being asked on a FAFSA form, but more importantly, it was supposed to increase the accessibility by helping all kids get better access to financial aid no matter what the circumstances are. So the fact that she had to go through that is terrifying.
Jasmyn: But even if things got better with the Simplification Act, the application process was still a mess with tons of technical glitches and errors, and now, with all the budget cuts, the number of staff at the Federal Student Aid Office has been decimated. On the other hand, completed application numbers seem to be up from last year, but we won’t know for sure until June.
Jojo: Stories like Gabby are commonplace for first gen students, and thankfully, there are people who can help school counselors next after a break. A counselor in downtown Manhattan will shed some light on the inner workings of this problem.
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Jojo: Welcome back. We’re your hosts, Jojo,
Jasmyn: And Jasmyn. When we were last with you, we discussed my friend Gabby, who struggled with her FAFSA application. She’s like many other students of undocumented parents who either don’t have enough required information or are scared of mentioning their parents’ documentation status.
Jojo: I interviewed Danielle Insel. She’s a college counselor at the University Neighborhood high school in Manhattan, Lower East Side. I wanted to get her take on a financial aid process for first gen students with undocumented parents.
Jojo: So you’re a counselor, as you–
Danielle: Yes,
Jojo: How long have you been doing counseling for?
Danielle: This would be my like, 12th year.
Jojo: I was curious about how she helps first gen students. Once they walk into her office.
Danielle: I first just make sure that they know I’m like, a safe, trusted individual, and I know trust is built over time, but like, I’m not gonna disclose anything to anyone, letting them know, like I’m here to guide them through the process and recognizing from their end that, like, they may not have as much exposure to this process as their peers, but definitely like exposure, exposure, exposure to as many things as possible. So taking them on college trips, having them, bringing admissions representatives here, letting them know that, like they’re not alone, like there are so many first generation college students, not just in our school, not just in our state, but in our country there, you know, and reminding them that I’ll be with them through, like, the whole process. And also, I also would say, like talking to the families, I think it’s important to make that like connection, you know, like talking to their parents and explaining the best I can. And if they, if English is not their first language, finding an interpreter, like, that’s really important.
Jojo: Language barrier
Danielle: Yeah, language barrier is definitely a big one. You know, we have to pay attention to the news. Like, there’s a lot going on with immigration and and education cuts and federal cuts and like, how does that impact students? There’s just a lot. So I think a lot goes into it,
Jojo: Right, so what do you do for students whose FAFSA takes more time due to unique circumstances, like undocumented, some files might be there, because, as we know, FAFSA can be at times, very unforgiving.
Danielle: Yes.
Jojo: How that works? Do you have any thoughts, and ideas?
Danielle: I do. It takes a lot of patience and a lot of persistence. Persistence is key, and I think I’m not going to show outward frustration. I show them like, okay, this doesn’t work. All right, then we’re gonna contact FAFSA. We’re gonna call, we’re gonna use the chat, we’re gonna contact the college. We’re just gonna keep communicating and keep doing what we need to do. I did have a very frustrating experience today with a student whose parents are undocumented. There’s this thing, if your parents are living together, they’re undocumented, and they’re working.
FAFSA does not, it does not work to submit the parental information that is required, you have to submit both parents information. FAFSA thought that you could, and I had to go back and forth with them today and be like, we’ve tried every single thing. It doesn’t work, and then you have to do the paper, FAFSA, which I don’t know how many months that takes the process,
Jojo: Paper?
Danielle: Paper.
Jojo: Wow!
Danielle: And that only happens to students whose parents are both undocumented living together and unmarried? Yeah, that would certainly have some economic divide. Oh, absolutely. And like, I don’t try like I, we acknowledge it all, you know, we acknowledge all the systems at play and how unfair it is and inequitable it’s like, for today, like, we submitted a paper FAFSA. I don’t know how long that’s going to process. It may not process by the time the student graduates from high school, and that it’s summer, right? So, like, I may not be around to, to ensure that that student’s FAFSA processes and they get the financial aid they need to actually attend college their first semester. So absolutely,
Jojo: That’s painful.
Danielle: Yeah, it is.
Jojo: Yeah, wow, as you might have already known, there was a FAFSA Simplification Act, right? Have you felt any changes? Do you feel like your students have been better supported? Or was there no change?
Danielle: Um, okay, so if we get past the technical issues that have definitely surmounted. I do think it is easier. It is easier. It’s easier for students. Well, for the most part, who’s whose parents are undocumented, it’s easier. It used to be a different process for them. That part is actually simplified a little bit. The problem is that the people who work at FAFSA, which aren’t many anymore, are not I feel like 100% up to date with how to navigate each challenge that arises. For example, what I just said earlier about like students whose parents are undocumented live together but are not married, the people at FAFSA that I spoke to this morning kept telling me, like, delete the account or use a different browser. It’s like we’ve tried the browsers. We’ve tried different wi-fi’s. It’s not that, it’s that those who have a particular immigration status are discriminated against, whether intentionally or not.
Jojo: As a counselor have, and it’s been for 12 years, right? So do you feel like how we handle first gen students? Has it gotten better?
Danielle: Yeah, I definitely think it’s gotten better. I think you hear a lot more colleges talking about them and figuring out ways to provide support for them so they’re not just like these hidden people anymore. They’re definitely out in the forefront, and I think that they feel more empowered than ever to like, advocate for themselves and make themselves known. But from when I started, oh my gosh. Like, a world’s difference, yeah. Like, you can even tell by. For example, like, New York State has a Dream Act that is now accessible to undocumented students or students who may not qualify for as much aid, and so for our first gen students, like that’s huge, and that didn’t exist when I started.
Jojo: As you know, we are in a different presidency now.
Danielle: Yes.
Jojo: Do you have hope for the future. You know, with the news and everything, I guess you can’t really ignore it.
Danielle: Can’t ignore it, but I think I’ll always remain hopeful for the future, because I think things come and go in waves. I think that those of us who are from a place of privilege or power like to make sure that we use our voices, you know, because I think could be a little scary right now for certain groups of people to speak up, so to make sure that we’re on the front lines and like, speaking out and speaking up and yeah, like, I mean, we’re not going anywhere, right?
And I always say, like, I know it sounds so cheesy, but like, I have so much faith and hope in the young people you know, like in you and like your peers and people your age, like you don’t like, take. You don’t like, I don’t know how to say this, like, without cursing or whatever, but like you don’t just like, take, you know what I mean? Like you actually are. Like, no, that’s not okay. No, you cannot talk to me that way. No, like I, I demand respect, you know, when I enter a space like I’m gonna have a seat at that table, like I’m bringing a chair, you know, so there’s where my hope lies.
Jasmyn: As first generation students in the midst of a deportation crisis, it’s more important than ever to check in. Counselors like Danielle do their best to campaign for support, but it starts with you. Our stories won’t tell themselves, and it’s our duty to make sure that our needs are not buried under misunderstanding and documents.
Jojo: Hey, speaking of stories, whatever did happen to Gabby?
Jasmyn: Oh, she’s doing great. She just got into all her SUNY’s and her target California schools, which was the goal. She’s really excited about it.
Jojo: Well, the final deadline for FAFSA is June 30.
Jasmyn: You’ve been listening to P.S. weekly.
Jojo: P.S. weekly is a collaboration between the bell and Chalkbeat made possible by the generous support from the Pinkerton Foundation, the Summerfield foundation and FJC.
Jasmyn: Producers for this episode were me Jasmyn Centeno
Jojo: And me Jojo Fofana, with reporting help from Chalkbeat reporter Michael Elsen-Rooney,
Jasmyn: Our executive producer for the show is Ave Carrillo, and executive editors were Amy Zimmer and Taylor McGraw.
Jojo: Additional production and reporting support was provided by Mira Gordon, Sabrina DuQuesnay and our friends at Chalkbeat. Our engagement editor is Carolina Hidalgo.
Jasmyn: Music is from Blue Dot sessions, and the jingle you heard at the beginning of this episode was created by Erica Huang.
Jojo: Thanks for tuning in. See you next time!
We make transcripts available for our episodes as soon as possible. They are not fully edited for grammar or spelling.
